Our latest interview and mix comes from Chris SSG. Between 2007 and 2012, Chris and PC ran one of the most influential music blogs of its era, MNML SSGS – releasing a plethora of mixes, giving countless music and event tips, and commenting on the music news of the time.
In recent years Chris has continued to host parties in Japan, while playing as an ambient DJ at the likes of Nachtdigital, Sustain-Release and most recently at Berghain’s Silvester Klubnacht. In this long awaited interview we talk about Public Enemy, the importance of setting for ambient music, the commercialisation of dance music and much more…
Hi Chris, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and where you grew up?
I am originally from Melbourne. I was fortunate to come of age at a time when the electronic music scene there was remarkably strong, both for techno and for more experimental sounds. These early experiences left a very strong imprint on me, in terms of the way that I think about electronic music and what I am trying to do with it. It is a long time since I have lived in Melbourne, the town and the scene has changed a lot, so it feels much less like home than it used to. But I am very conscious and appreciative of how much it shaped me. I think one aspect that has been there from these formative years is regarding techno and ambient / experimental as closely linked and related, both sides have been constant for me.
Can you tell us a bit about some of your favourite music and bands growing up, and also what led to your discovery of electronic music?
If I could pinpoint a moment where I could trace my musical trajectory back to, it would be on a scout camp when an older boy put on a tape by a band called Public Enemy. I had no idea who they were. The track that came on was “Terminator X to the Edge of Panic”:
When I got home, I immediately ordered a copy of “It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back”, and I got really into hip hop. Incidentally my first record was also by Public Enemy. From there, I moved into trip hop, Tricky and Portishead were really important. And it might not sound cool, but the early albums from Chemical Brothers and Daft Punk were key in transitioning to more electronic music. I was also listening to a lot of radio shows, and then when I turned 18, I started going to parties and things developed quickly from there. Jeff Mills, Speedy J and the Advent were some of the techno artists I really got into at the start, for more experimental music it was Vladislav Delay, Pan Sonic, and anything on Mego and Mille Plateaux / Force Inc. That was late 90s when I was doing my undergraduate studies. At that time I strongly believed that my interest in electronic music was a phase that I would quickly grow out of. That proved to be a rather incorrect assumption…
Having written for music publications such as RA previously, what was your motivation behind creating MNML SSGS?
I had always viewed myself just as a punter. I only had a few friends who were into electronic music, I was not very outgoing at parties, so even though I was going to a lot of events, I was very much on the fringe. A chance encounter at a Skam party at the old Liquid Room in Tokyo would ultimately lead to the connections that would take me to writing for RA initially and then starting MNML SSGS. RA was a very different beast back then (mid ‘00s), but still we found it wasn’t quite the right outlet for what we wanted to do. At the time, 4 of us had an ongoing email thread about music we liked, and on more of a whim than anything, we decided to found the blog and effectively move that conversation from email to a public forum. If we were being more strategic, perhaps we would have come up with a different name or approach, but in the end, the way it naturally developed worked wonderfully well.
Most mix series release one mix from any artist, or maybe another under a different alias. MNML SSGS hosted upwards of three mixes from the likes of Donato Dozzy, an artist who rarely releases mixes! How did this relationship between MNML SSGS and Donato come about?
We were very fortunate with all the mixes we had on the blog. With Donato, an important part of it was a friendship that developed through shared experience. But with him, I think it was the same as it was for many other artists we worked with: they trusted us, they believed our intentions and felt there was something honest to what we were doing. I think Donato felt like the blog was a good home for his music: it would be reaching likeminded souls. The blog was never about trying to develop a brand, trying to be cool, trying to advance our own music careers. It was a genuine manifestation of our passion and love of this music. I think artists and readers understood and connected with that sincerity.
My favourite ssgs mix is the final PVH mix, a live recording from the Enter The Labyrinth party at Unit, Tokyo soon after the Tōhoku Earthquake and Fukushima Disaster in 2011. The listener can really feel the energy and the emotion behind it. How did you choose the fnl ssgs mixes, and are there any other mixes from the series that standout to you in particular?
We reached a point where it was time for the blog to end, and finishing the mixes properly was an important part of that. We wanted to get some artists who were connected to the development of the blog, as well as people we were excited about at that moment. That set from PVH was powerful and emotional. Sometimes recordings do not capture the magic felt in the moment, but that one does. It brought together and echoed a lot of the themes and elements of the blog, so it seemed like a logical and natural way to finish things.
Is there any chance of an archive coming soon?
We get asked a lot about the archive… Unfortunately the server we used for hosting them all disappeared at some point. PC and I have ambivalent feelings about putting up the full archive again. We like the idea of it being something transient, a special moment that passed. The mix series was so connected to that specific time. When we started, there were not many mix series, and podcasts were just coming into their own as an art form. So we were able to do some really special things that it is just not possible to do now. And this gets to the other side, that there were many amazing mixes, which are historically important and deserve to be heard. Some mixes are out there, perhaps others can be sourced and shared too, maybe an archive will appear at some point. There is no need for us to be the ones to do it. We did our bit, and honestly, we both like the idea of the blog just sitting there, gathering electronic tumbleweeds, a monument to a techno future that never quite came to pass.
How was your most recent experience playing at Silvester Klubnacht?
The 1st time I played at Berghain was important for me in terms of my artistic development, preparing for it helped me crystalise in my mind what I was trying to achieve with my DJing. That set went well, and was valuable in my subsequent trajectory. Coming back 4 years I was much more confident in myself as an artist, more sure of what I am doing. So it was nice not feeling as much pressure or stress, and just playing. I tried to convey a good representation of my sound, and to do something that made sense in that context. I purposefully went back and included different tracks and themes from the last few years, so it felt a bit like a review of where I have been with my DJing. I can’t remember what I started with, I think Biosphere, and I finished with one of my favourite Coil tracks. So that was cool. And once again I took some important lessons from the experience.
As someone who listens to all forms of electronic what led to you becoming an ‘ambient DJ’ and how has the presence of an ambient room/stage at events changed since you started DJing?
Maybe 7 or 8 years ago now, my friends and I were talking about the lack of ambient events, and we decided to try doing a chill out party, which we called ‘Sound Garden’. Until that point, I had largely avoided DJing, and still didn’t have an urge to do anything techno, but trying listening-style sets interested me. So that is when I started to focus more on DJing, and I discovered that playing ambient is a very interesting puzzle for me. Finding a way to structure a set, to create different energies and moods, you have to do all of this without the kind of usual tools and techniques that you have with dancefloor-orientated music. Over the years, I have tried to develop a specific aesthetic and approach to presenting ambient music, and hopefully that is something some people connect with.
As for the presence of ambient stages and events, there has been a bit more interest in the last couple of years, but it is still very limited. Doing ambient or experimental often requires a bit more thought and preparation, and it is also engages the audience in a different way. So if it is not presented well it can really miss the mark. But when done well, people can have a very powerful and worthwhile experience. I think there is still a lot space for interest to grow with ambient music, people often respond well at the right moment and setting, but it takes thought and effort. From my perspective, as an artist I am also thinking about how I can present ambient music in a way that people can understand and connect with it, even if they don’t necessarily have much experience with it.
You have played at some amazing festivals and clubs, such as Sustain-Release, Nachtdigital, Unit, Concrete to name a few. Can you describe how your preparation for a set differs with the setting and the time of the set? And which festivals/clubs stand out to you most have provided the best ambient stage/room?
Connecting on to the last point, it is important to recognize what is possible at an event and what you can do with a certain crowd. There are plenty of situations where ambient does not make sense, and I am very cognizant of that. When I am opening a night or a festival, I like to start with ambient and try delaying a bit longer moving into beats, but when I do, doing so quite slowly and carefully. For sets where it is straight ambient, it also comes down a lot to the context. At some moments, a quieter and more gentle approach can work best, at other times, I might be playing ambient but in a bright and bold way. Context is so important.
What is your opinion on the commercialisation of ‘underground’ music, in cities like London where in my opinion it has become a monopoly run by big business, and in countries such as Saudi Arabia where it is being used to encourage tourism and improve ‘image’?
I could say a lot about this, it is a complex topic… I think a lot of people recognize things have been shifting, but don’t fully understand what has been going on. Where it has been challenging is that you have a big set of cultural shifts in terms of politics and values and these have interacted in a complicated way with economic changes that have troubling ramifications for the viability and health of the scene. There is a lot of focus on identity-related issues now, and much positive has come from this, but at the same time, this has distracted a lot of people from the increasingly uneven distribution of opportunity for artists. Things are complicated and complex, we can have positive and negative trends happen at the same time, and this is certainly the case. In terms of the economics, basically middle-income DJs and producers are getting squeezed out, more and more money and opportunity is flowing to an elite group of artists at the top, with scraps for the rest. Add in all the problems with revenue from producing music, and we are looking at a scene in which many artists have limited opportunity to be able to have sustainable incomes. There had been a space for middle tier artists to make enough money to survive off their music, that space is increasingly disappearing. We are increasingly moving to an economic structure in electronic music that mirrors and echoes the rest of society: the 1% taking most of the money and opportunity, the rest getting less and less. And the problem is, this just does not seem sustainable in the long run. But then again, not many people like thinking about sustainability.
And as for that Saudi festival and the artists playing there getting a free pass by RA and other music sites after they go after every indiscretion or mistake on social media… It just shows you how thin ‘front left’ politics are, interests wrapped up in values. So much of it has become about virtue signaling and virtual blood sport. Bad faith is increasingly the dominant mode of interaction online these days.
What is your view on Techno twitter (and cancel culture)?
One of my alltime favourite mix CDs is Matthew Herbert – “Letsallmakemistakes”.
It is wonderful, it is from the golden era of mix CDs. It is so playful, beautifully selected. Anyway… this mentality is one that simply has gone. There is so little room for mistakes these days. Now certainly some mistakes are more serious than others, but I think the idea in that Herbert mix is that making mistakes is very natural, it is human, we all do it. There needs to be room to do so, it is important for growing and learning. I worry that there is much less space for that now.
With MNML SSGS, we made so many mistakes. We didn’t know what we were doing, we didn’t understand initially how many people were reading us or picking up things we said, we didn’t appreciate the potential consequences of some of the things we did. And sometimes when you write something when you are angry, or tired, or just not thinking, it is not the best formulation of what you are trying to say, or more basically, not the best version of you. Even back then, we got hammered pretty regularly by people for what we put online, and some of that hammering was definitely deserved. But we still had space and room to grow and to learn, and I became a better person through my mistakes, I learned how to engage better online, to be more careful about what I say and how I say it. I do think it is important that people be held account for what they say and do, it shouldn’t be free passes and high fives for everyone. But. But proportion is necessary. And space for making mistakes is necessary.
Beyond all that, it is really important to appreciate that so much of the social media discourse – ‘techno twitter’ – is just people being bored and distracting themselves, most shitstorms only last for a day or two, before everyone moves on to something else to be upset about. More generally, the idea that you can build and preserve something through knifing people, yeah, I am skeptical about this logic.
What plans do you have for 2020?
I know what I do is very niche and there are limited opportunities. I do think there is more potential for people to find and connect with ambient, so I like working with promoters on trying out ambient shows. Recently I have done shows in Singapore, Shanghai, Beijing and Canberra, and for all of them, ambient parties are still not so common, so it has been encouraging trying something and thinking about how to present it in the right way.
More generally, even if MNML SSGS finished quite some time ago, there is a certain mentality and aesthetic that we had, and I am conscious about continuing to develop and advance that in different ways. Being honest and sincere in the way I approach music, thinking about it as a culture that requires nurturing and protecting, this is what I want to keep doing. I enjoy DJing, I hope I can continue to get opportunities to do so, but I also want to keep working with others to put on events and support this community and culture that has given so much meaning and value to my life.
Can you tell us a bit about this mix?
Given that the interview had quite a few questions reflecting on different moments in my musical trajectory, I wanted to share something that matched with that. This is a mix I made some time ago, but never did anything with. It is a very understated and simple mix that is really focused on the tracks themselves. Most of the music I selected has been with me for a long time and has meaning for me. The mix is called ‘safe harbour’; it is meant for a time of rest, a period to reflect on what has happened, to think about what has changed and what remains constant. It was composed in a more deliberate fashion, seeking to distil a specific set of feelings. The mix is one for late at nights, when time fades away.
Words By: James Acquaye Nortey-Glover
thank you for the enlightening words. xn